Images uploaded by Stumpy2121 [ edit ]

• File:The mystery ketch, as drawn by Guy Wallace.jpg
• File:Ben Smart and Olivia Hope.jpg
• File:Wallace's sketch superimposed over a photo of Blade.jpg
• File:Scott Watson next to the Identikit of the unknown man.jpg
• File:Half of montage B, featuring the "blink photo" of Scott Watson.jpg
• File:Marlborough Sounds.png
• File:Furneaux Map.png

This set of images regarding a New Zealand murder case has been uploaded to Commons with dubious claims of a Creative Commons 4.0 license, with the underlying originals in some instances being described by the uploader as "public domain". (Some of the images might qualify for WP:FAIRUSE on Wikipedia.) ? Muzilon ( talk ) 09:42, 15 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

• Delete Obviously false claim of CC 4.0 status. Nick-D ( talk ) 09:56, 15 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]
  • I'd suggest adding File:Marlborough Sounds.png to this nomination. The source states the image is released on the condition that it be distributed further only "free of charge", so it also has been uploaded by this user under a false CC 4.0 claim. Nick-D ( talk ) 10:01, 15 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

OK, I've added that map image, at your suggestion. (I hesitated to include it with the original request because it wasn't as blatant a COPYVIO as the other images.) ? Muzilon ( talk ) 10:18, 15 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

• I contacted the author Ian Wishart directly asking about the copyright on the photos added. He confirmed that they are public domain and his publisher needed no permission to use said images in his book. I requested he provide me with copies of the photos he used, the photos added are provided by him directly. i have copies of the conversation, in which confirms all the photos i used are public domian. im new to wikipedia, please advise what i should do further. there no copyright holder for these images.-- Stumpy2121 ( talk ) 11:29, 15 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

• the map has the following rights statement "This image may be used, copied and re-distributed free of charge in any format or media. Where the image is redistributed to others the following acknowledgement note should be shown?: "Sourced from LINZ. Crown Copyright reserved." i concede i may have misinterpreted that rights statement-- Stumpy2121 ( talk ) 11:32, 15 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

See Commons:Licensing ? these images would have to be freely licensed in both the USA (where Wikimedia Commons is hosted) and New Zealand. As a very rough guide, copyright in New Zealand normally remains in place until 50 years after the death of the creator/photographer; in the USA, 70 years for recent works (with various exceptions). Therefore, the notion that these are "public domain" is doubtful. These images are mostly police mugshots/Identikits, eyewitness sketches, and a family snapshot for which Ian Wishart is neither the original creator nor the copyright holder. Even if police mugshots are not copyrighted in New Zealand (a quick Google search didn't turn up any clear guidance about this), then we'd still have the hurdle of U.S. copyright. Muzilon ( talk ) 12:46, 15 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

Muzilon thank you for the guidance. The claim is not that Wishart created or owns the rights to these images, rather that he states that there is no restriction in regard to their use as they were released to public domain. Because he has used the images in a commercial context, i took that as fact. If i were to get permission from NZ Police releasing the images, or alternatively a statement from them that they make no claim to the copyright of the images, would that be sufficient? i realise that you may have answered these types of questions before, it is not my intention to continue asking you to explain image use on Wikipedia beyond this query.-- Stumpy2121 ( talk ) 22:19, 15 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

I'm not an expert, but I suppose in theory you could approach the NZ Police with a request that they authorize Commons to use the images over which they have authority ? see Commons:OTRS and Commons:Email templates . But I think it likely the rights to the "Ben & Olivia" snapshot and the newspaper photo of Watson leaving court would technically be held by the respective photographers rather than the NZ Police. Muzilon ( talk ) 23:03, 15 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

Muzilon i appreciate your help. I do feel as though this is article far from complete without photo reference of the victims, so i will see what i can do. As the copyright issues are unlikely to be resolved in a timely manner, i have no objection to the deletion of the images i have uploaded, and apologise for uploading them without sufficient evidence of their copyright status. ??Preceding unsigned comment added by Stumpy2121 ( talk ??? contribs ) 00:03, 16 June 2021? (UTC) [ reply ]

The photo of Ben and Olivia might qualify for WP:FAIRUSE on Wikipedia ? but not on Commons, which only accepts freely licensed images. Cf. the photos of the victims at w:Murder of Urban Hoglin and Heidi Paakkonen and w:Murder of Harvey and Jeannette Crewe . Muzilon ( talk ) 15:57, 16 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

Stumpy2121 I'm sorry to have to say that I think your self-created File:Furneaux Map.png needs to be deleted too. Whether or not the map you've used as a template is freely licensed, the text has a major typo (Furne a ux Lodge is mispelled as "Furneux"), which means it's not really suitable for Wikipedia. Muzilon ( talk ) 09:53, 17 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

A typo isn't grounds for deletion, as a corrected version can be uploaded over the top. I would want to know what the source of the base map is, as this doesn't appear to have been hand-drawn. Nick-D ( talk ) 09:57, 17 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

Yes, does this constitute a Derivative work ? Muzilon ( talk ) 10:09, 17 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

Muzilon , Nick-D apologies for the typo. It appears that i am destined to stand on every rake possible on the path to successfully uploading an image to this article. The image is hand drawn from scratch using a digital stylus, i used multiple reference images for inspiration. It is my understanding that the shape of New Zealand itself is not copyrighted, is that correct? If i reupload would the image again be challenged? Or is there more i need to do to prove that this is not created by editing another persons work? ??Preceding unsigned comment added by Stumpy2121 ( talk ??? contribs ) 21:54, 18 June 2021? (UTC) [ reply ]

There's no rule (as far as I know!) against contributors designing their own maps ? you'll find one such example at File:NZ-SI_plain_map.png . I'd suggest you correct the typo and re-upload the image with a note in the licensing description that the map is your own original work. PS. Please remember to sign your comments on Talk pages with the four tildes ~~~~ (I've taken the liberty of correcting that for you here). Kind regards, Muzilon ( talk ) 00:13, 18 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

thank you Muzilon , Im much more familiar with the visual editor which Wikipedia wont allow me to use on this page for some reason. I appreciate your patience. I will look to address the issues with the image-- Stumpy2121 ( talk ) 00:40, 18 June 2021 (UTC) [ reply ]

Deleted: most files per nomination as missing Commons:EVIDENCE of COM:Permission . Kept the handdrawn map per above (please use "Upload new version" if you fix the typo). -- Jonatan Svensson Glad ( talk ) 14:41, 16 January 2022 (UTC) [ reply ]